|
Print
I am Going to Stay a Perpetual New Convert with
My Worship"
Wayne Francis - The ninetyandnine.com
Interview
By Kent d Curry and Sarah k. Holland
October 17, 2005
It couldn’t have been that
difficult to get 10,000+ Apostolic young people on their feet on the final night
of North American Youth Congress 2005. Yet, the man responsible for leading
Friday night praise and worship did so with such passion and flair that he
almost stole the show. He didn’t know it then but it was Wayne Francis’ big
coming out party to the wider Apostolic world.
He’s one of those
“overnight-sensation-after-10-years-of-hard-work” stories. Before Youth
Congress, Francis was already a UPCI District Youth President,
highly visible on the Bible school circuit, connected to some of the bigger
names in Pentecost, and most recently the Director of Promotions for the General
Youth Division of the UPCI. It was just time for everyone else to realize who
he was and how much he loved God.
He is also that oddest of
contradictions—a reading extrovert. We wanted to uncover his heartbeat and he
was more than happy to comply with our interview request, actually thanking us
afterwards. “Strangely enough, it ministered to me. It helped me roll back the
curtains again and take a look at some things,” he admitted. His answers give us
some things to consider as well.
This interview took place in
September, 2005.
FAMILY
90&9: For most people,
Youth Congress would be their August 2005 highlight. Not for you. Tell us about
your August 2005 highlight.
Wayne Francis:
The highlight for me was the birth of our second daughter, Ryleigh Isabella.
She weighed in at 7 lbs 5 oz and she is gorgeous!
90&9: And who does the
rest of your family consist of?
WF: My family
consists of the very beautiful and elegant Claudene, who I affectionately call
“Classy,” and the most adorable girl in the world, Haleigh Jade.
90&9: How long have you
been married?
WF: Classy and I
celebrated our sixth anniversary on
9/11. Isn’t that wild? And check this out, this year was nice and mild for
us…we were in the city the day the attacks occurred. On our honeymoon, a
hurricane hit the Bahamas and we had to evacuate our room and stay in the
convention center with the other guests for two nights! Then on my anniversary
in 2002, my wife and I were going to meet the board to get my ministerial
license and my car overheated and we couldn’t meet the board. In 2003, a
tornado hit Indianapolis. Thank God 2004 was calm and this year was quite
laid-back as well.
90&9: How did you know
she was the one?
WF: I’ve known
Classy for most of my life. Her dad pastored the church my family went to. I
didn’t get the Holy Ghost until I was 18 and so for many years I stopped going
to church. When I finally decided to serve the Lord, I started going to her
dad’s church. I’ll never forget the day that I was reacquainted with her. Her
dad was making announcements and told the church he was happy that his daughter
was back home. Her job had relocated her to Connecticut and she received a
promotion that brought her back home. She had a navy blue and white suit, sort
of Jackie O-looking, you know, and this beautiful broad rimmed hat that was
leaned elegantly to the side and her hair was in curls and seemed to rest
perfectly on her shoulders. She was standing and smiling and I was sitting in
the audience thinking, “This chick’s got it going on! She is gorgeous!” And I
literally thought, “She’s the type of girl I’d like to marry.” It wasn’t until
years later that we started dating and eventually became a couple.
90&9: Do you have a
favorite dating story?
WF: Not
particularly because we used to hang out so much. I guess one of the best
places we went for a date was a restaurant in Manhattan on the Upper East Side.
Beautiful brick walls inside of it…hardwood floors…small tables nestled in
corners…dimly lit…black velvet feeling atmosphere…pianist and live jazz. It was
awesome. I asked her to marry me in that same restaurant.
PERSONAL BACKGROUND
90&9: Tell us a little
about your family and where you grew up.
WF: I have four
older sisters. My family is predominately Jamaican. I was the only one born
here. I was born in the Bronx or the Brizz-onx and lived there for most of my
life. We lived in a nice neighborhood and had a very exciting childhood. It
was a blast growing up in the 80’s and 90’s. The music, the gear (remember acid
wash jeans, Sergio Valente’s and two-tone jeans?!)—the Bronx was so alive back
then; it began to deteriorate when I became a teenager. The influence of drugs
and “gangs” (New Yorkers didn’t use the word gangs back then—we used words like
“crew” and “posse”). I really started to have a rough time in high school with
peer pressure and trying to be “down,” but I had a praying grandmother that
really wouldn’t stop calling my name before the Lord.
My sisters are all pretty
nuts. We have a fun family. My parents are divorced, unfortunately. We have a
real good time when we are together…fighting over food (Sunday dinner is a big
thing with my family) and snapping on each other and my mother. We love
snapping on each other (Look at Pat’s head…her head is out of control…she looks
like she’s a head of her time…She certainly knows where she’s headed).
90&9: What’s your
educational background?
WF: I went to
several colleges. I studied Business at Fairleigh Dickinson University in
Teaneck, NJ. I then graduated from Westchester Community College in Valhalla,
NY with an Associate’s Degree in Liberal Arts/Social Science. I took more
coursework at Pace University (NYC) in Business Management before abbreviating
my studies and going to Indiana Bible College (IBC). I graduated from IBC in
1999. Most recently, I completed my undergraduate education at Indiana Wesleyan
University. I now have a B.A. in Business Management. I took a graduate course
from Azusa Pacific University hoping to acquire a Masters degree in
organizational management.
However, the flux associated
with the transition to the General Youth Division (GYD) caused me to get lazy
and I withdrew from the course. Plus, I didn’t like the e-learning
environment. I need to be around people! I plan to enroll in a program here in
St. Louis next fall. I determined to be a life learner and I really enjoy being
in school.
90&9: What would you
advise Christian youth today in regards to Bible college and secular college?
WF: Before going
to IBC, I had earned an Associate’s degree and I think it was the best thing
that I could have done. After going to IBC and returning to the fiercely
competitive job market in NYC, I had something on my resume that employers
qualified as authentic educational background. I believed that my education
from IBC was authentic but to some employers it was not applicable to their list
of core competencies for their position. It was my experience that some
employers looked at my degree from IBC as “extra-curricular” in some ways.
However, I think it’s
important for students who feel a call of God on their life not to minimize the
importance of going to Bible College. I think all of it is an individual’s
choice, but I believe in balance. I think it is extremely important for young
people to have a secular education to be able to secure jobs in the workforce
and to have influence in the lives of unbelievers on campuses and because we
need Apostolics to be involved in fields of study and in the vast landscape of
corporate professions. So students who feel called to the ministry should go to
Bible College, but realistically they should either go to a secular college for
two years before they go, or plan on going to secular school after they go to
Bible College. Full-time ministry offers are very limited so it’s important for
young people to be able to secure good employment if they are not able to secure
a full-time position. And, enhancing your education will only help a person
become a well-rounded minister.
I can’t go on without saying
that I think it’s very important for young people who feel a call of God to go
to Bible College. I would not be doing what I am doing today if I did not go to
Bible College. Bible school gave me the chance to explore the call of God on my
life and to develop a strong biblical education. I met the most incredible
people that have shaped and formed my life and ministry.
I think we have this weird
cultural path for our young people that makes them feel like they need to be in
a rush—a rush to get married, a rush to have a ministry position, etc. Our
young people could get a great education from a Bible College and a secular
college and graduate from both colleges by the time they are 26!
Balance is the key word.
90&9: Now I’ve heard you
preach that you didn’t come to the Lord until you were 19. What happened there?
WF: I basically
just lived out in the world. I was a party guy—loved to dance and smoke,
drink. I always felt a call on my life to be involved in ministry but I wanted
to have fun and party. I can remember getting into fights or being in a party
and thinking that I didn’t belong there. I can remember one time when my crew
and I got into a fight with these other kids and one of them pulled out a gun
and started shooting at us. I was running over a bridge, over I-95 with this
weird mixture of feelings. I was scared, but I was having fun because I was
with my boys and we thought we were tough and were going to be able to tell a
story about it. And I remember the night being warm and many stars being out.
It was like the stars were angels’ eyes looking at me. For some reason, I knew
I wasn’t going to die and I can remember talking to God running at full speed
and saying, “If You get me out of this, I am going to serve You and do all I can
for You.” I didn’t hear anything audible but I felt wanted. Like He was
impressing upon me a feeling of destiny. I felt like He was showing me all that
I could be for Him.
I still went back and lived
horribly until I got the Holy Ghost in my best friend’s living room. I made a
few mistakes shortly after that. However, I went to General Conference in San
Antonio in 1996. The youth day speaker was Wayne Huntley and he preached, “Will
you do for your God what the heathens do for their god?” It changed my life.
It was that day that I accepted the call of God on my life to do ministry—not to
preach, although I felt called to preach. I just submitted my life to God. I
knew how passionate I was for the world and vowed that I would be even more
passionate with my life in Christ.
90&9: How did you end up
in the ministry?
WF: Shortly
after General Conference, my pastor got me involved in youth work and it was
awesome. I preached my first sermon, “Praise Him in the Hold.” And I became
assistant Youth Pastor. IBC Chorale came by my church and sang. It was a
wrap. I was so mesmerized by these young people singing and exhorting and it
inspired me so much. I wanted to be just like them. I had felt impressed to go
to Bible school after General Conference but seeing the chorale impacted me in a
huge way. I went to Bible school and IBC just totally changed my life. I
sought God; got involved with learning and doing dramas and singing and
preaching and meeting new people and before I knew it, I was in the ministry.
90&9: So you were called
to preach, and immediately were given the pastorate of a huge church, right?
WF: Nope. I
actually warmed the bench for two years before getting involved in full-time
ministry. I was actually pretty hurt because you know, you go to Bible College
and you come back home and everybody is just supposed to make you the youth
pastor and you should have your office and blah…blah…blah.
Actually, I didn’t have that
type of attitude, but I did have a spirit of entitlement on me and God really
broke me down as I wasn’t involved in the ministry capacity I wished I was.
But, I supported those who were. I really wanted to be the youth pastor, but I
decided that I had a call to work with youth whether I had a position or I
didn’t. I went to every youth service. I asked if I could help my youth pastor
in any way that I could. I praise sang. I did altar work. I cleaned. I set up.
I broke down. I was in the youth choir. I worshipped like I was going out of my
mind. I studied. I submitted.
It wasn’t too long before
Harold Linder started taking me under his wing and showing me the ropes on what
he did as Youth President. He gave me so many opportunities to plan and execute
district functions. I was elected Youth President of NY Metro in 2001. Only a
year and a half afterwards, Bro. Paul Mooney asked me to come on board at IBC as
the Dean of Students and Campus Pastor. Two and half years after that, Bro.
Todd Gaddy invited me to be a part of the GYD team.
God has been good, but you
better believe that I was crushed during those two years, amidst that
involvement in anything I could—I wanted to give up on the ministry.
90&9: Was that a better
career path than “the dream” of pastoring a large church immediately?
WF: Oh yes.
Because there was a blessing in my breaking. All of my Bible school friends
were doing cool things—they were on PRAISE and traveling and going to the
Philippines and this that and the other and I was working for the Tea
Association! But in that phase, I drew so close to God. I would just cry at
the altar and ask God to literally help me to be a blessing to my generation. I
wanted so badly to be involved with young people. But I had to break. My ego,
my dreams had to shatter before they could be realized and I am
SSSSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOO glad I went through that. There was so much my wife and I
went through, but the Lord, He’s been good.
90&9: How do you break
down the race barriers in an organization that is mostly white? Is it even an
issue?
WF: It is not
much of an issue to me at all. I’ve had the privilege of interacting with many
cultures since I was young. Oprah Winfrey said something years and years ago
that inspired me. She was asked about the ways to overcome racism; she said,
“Excellence is the deterrence to ignorance.” I thought that was cool so I
decided I would have an excellent attitude toward everyone regardless of how
they treat me. I have chosen not to be suspicious and to look for things that
some would deem as unfair treatment. While I acknowledge and love being a black
person I have never let that define me. I am not a black preacher, I am just a
preacher. I think you just have to be comfortable being you. I heard somebody
say, “You just got to do you.” I don’t give much thought to race relations, I
just do Wayne.
HERE & NOW
90&9: So what does GYD’s
Director of Promotions do?
WF: I get to
work with cool graphic designers and design ads and promotions for our
division. I promote all the GYD ‘brands’ and work on special projects.
90&9: What are you most
excited about at the moment? Why?
WF: I am most
excited about the Commune-ity, our new youth workers resource club. It is going
to rock; it is going to revolutionize youth ministry in the UPCI. It is the
first Apostolic resource club that will be on par with contemporary youth worker
clubs. Now, youth pastors will have a site and resources. As my friend Paul
Povolni puts it, “Culturally relevant and biblically sound.” We’ve got cool
products like very high quality t-shirts, youth worker cards, audio and video
resources forthcoming. It’s gonna be awesome. January 1, 2006 we launch the
website. You need to move in!
90&9:
What change do you personally want to affect?
Why does that drive you?
WF: I
want to help our generation to preserve the landmarks our forefathers have set.
However, I want our generation to enlarge our territory and our influence using
those same pillars that were set. I think we are going to be the generation
that speaks to our culture with relevance and love. This is my driving passion
because I believe our message is awesome and I believe that young people today
want it. We don’t have to be intimidated to share this; we need to be
culturally relevant while holding on to our doctrinal distinctiveness.
90&9: What impresses you
most about today’s Apostolic young people?
WF: They are
comfortable with taking our classic stand on holiness and separation from the
world and making that look cool and hip. They love to worship and they love
preaching. They are energetic and I really feel like they are going to change
the world.
90&9: What do you see
Apostolic young people today lacking?
WF: Dedication.
Consistency. Sacrifice. Diligence.
90&9: What can remedy
that?
WF: Prayer,
worship, and memorizing the Word. Sometimes we think that you have to be on the
Bible Quizzing team to memorize the Word, but we have to get our students back
to reading and internalizing the Bible. I also think we need to teach our kids
the art of apologetics (as) they seem nervous in articulating the gospel to
their peers.
90&9: Do you see any
changes—for our 12-35 year olds—on the horizons?
WF: After
Youth Congress this year I realize that a great thing is happening among
us. We actually are starting to realize that we can have influence. I love
this renaissance that is occurring. I think our kids are wanting to go to
secular schools and get great jobs and many are wanting to go to Bible schools
and change their world. All the messages seemed to challenge this generation to
go and do something, to go and win somebody, and that they could do that
wherever they are.
Most authors and columnists
are calling the generation of young people 12–30 as the next great generation.
This generation is into volunteering and social justice. I think that is going
to help Apostolics win our communities, when students want to involve themselves
in improving the world and not necessarily having to get something in return.
90&9: What other
challenges do you see on the horizon for the Apostolic movement?
WF: I think our
kids have to guard the truth. Postmodernism (some say postmodernism is passé,
we’ll have to talk about that in another interview) is intimidating our young
people. More than ever, we have to keep our kids in tune with the truth,
heightening their understanding and love for the doctrine and providing them
with training in apologetics so that they can respond to the challenges of our
era.
MISCELLANEOUS
90&9: You are an
exuberant preacher and singer for the Lord. What drives that energetic, outward
exuberance at church?
WF: I always
loved to sing at church and although I don’t have a good voice, I felt
passionate to sing. Kirk Franklin really inspired me when I first got into
church because he was so passionate about his music but his voice is hit. And I
thought, ‘Man, I just want to sing and worship! I don’t care what people
think.’ I used to get made fun of and stuff, but I just kept singing. I feel
very passionate about worship and I think if you love to worship, you don’t care
about what others think.
I remember so vividly being
under the strobe light influence of clubs with the music and the whole
atmosphere and I would just throw down. Wayne Huntley helped me to realize that
I could put all my energy to where it belongs—on God. God’s brought me out of
so much that I will never ever allow myself not to worship Him. I am going to
stay a perpetual new convert with my worship.
90&9: I’m told you have a
small cadre of youth leaders around the country you tap into. Is that true? If
yes, why do you do this? What are the benefits?
WF:Yes it is. I
want to stay connected with influencers, thinkers, and people who are going to
make a difference. Plus, I like to connect with people that think differently
from me, are older than me, younger than me, from a different culture than me,
etc.
I feel like that helps me to
stay relevant and sharp. I want to feel the pulse of what is going on in the
world. I want to be in the “know.” I want to have people point me toward
resources that will add value to my life.
I also try to keep a cadre
of aspiring young ministers around me that I can pour into as well.
90&9: You’re an avid
reader. Why is that important to you?
WF: Leaders are
readers. Bro. Mooney really put a passion in me to read. I try to read a lot
of different things from fiction to non fiction. It helps to broaden my mental
horizons and to have things to discuss with people. It creates depth in a
person’s life and it really helps me when ministering.
90&9: Can you recommend
some good books to us?
WF: I recently
enjoyed Never Blink in a Hailstorm by David McKenna and The Art of the
Start by Guy Kawaiski.
ninetyandnine.com
©
2005, Kent d Curry and Sarah k. Holland
---------
Kent d Curry
is an executive editor of ninetyandnine.com. Sarah k. Holland is a
copy editor for ninetyandnine.com. | 
